[balistic]

Your friend's theory fails to account for alcohol and desperation.

[Etict]

Damn, that theory actually has some vague point considering what might happen in a long run. I mean, it's pure evolution right? Strong things live and evolve, weak things don't. When world is filled with the way of thinking of the western world, meaning that beauty is Da Thing, some science fiction writer could get a good... hmm... <--- opens WordPad and starts to make notes...

[Impaler]

H.G. Wells accounts for that theory, to a point. See, the ugly people like me will start breeding exclusively with the other uglies, and not with the beauties, and vice versa. Thus, given 300,000 years or so, we'll have separated into two different species. The uglies, being much smarter from their lack of sex in high school and social separation (more studying time), will enslave the mentally depraved and generally useless beauties, and use them for sexual slavery or housekeeping (what? cannibalism? COME ON.).

My advice for the future? Start punching yourself in the face at least seven times a day. It's your only hope to remain a free spirit.

[Awetopsy]

you last few posters are starting to soundlike hitler....

every body is beautiful to somebody else....
take this.... person?... for example..

[edit]removed picture because I feel it was inappropriate

[ July 30, 2001: Message edited by: Awetopsy ]

[aquamire]

You people aren't serious are you? Christ, beauty is subjective. You know what I cant stand? The 'plastic' perfect girls that every guy and their brother drools over. Every girl that tries to look like a model, and so on. This culture is so fucking fixated on one generalization of the female sex (ie, every god damned blonde bimbo you see on TV, like Friends). It's no god damned wonder girls are starving themselves to death. It makes me sick.

You know, I dated a girl who might not of been the most stereotypicaly beautiful girl in the world, or anywheres near. When I first got to know her, I can honestly say I wasn't exactly physically attracted to her all that much. In time, I fell head over heels for her, and it was like bam! I felt so much for her unique personality, she just seemed like the most gourgeous person in the world to me. It taught me to never judge a person on looks alone. When you really get to know a person, and their personality appeals to you, their physical apperances seem to change in reflectance of that personality.

[Superbug]

True aqmire true. I agree with what you say totally. Hey, as the guy said in in Chicken Run.

"Stupid yanks, oversexed...."

or something like that.....I forget.

[Lemur-X]

quote:

---

Originally posted by aquamire:
You people aren't serious are you? Christ, beauty is subjective. You know what I cant stand? The 'plastic' perfect girls that every guy and their brother drools over. Every girl that tries to look like a model, and so on. This culture is so fucking fixated on one generalization of the female sex (ie, every god damned blonde bimbo you see on TV, like Friends). It's no god damned wonder girls are starving themselves to death. It makes me sick.

You know, I dated a girl who might not of been the most stereotypicaly beautiful girl in the world, or anywheres near. When I first got to know her, I can honestly say I wasn't exactly physically attracted to her all that much. In time, I fell head over heels for her, and it was like bam! I felt so much for her unique personality, she just seemed like the most gourgeous person in the world to me. It taught me to never judge a person on looks alone. When you really get to know a person, and their personality appeals to you, their physical apperances seem to change in reflectance of that personality.

---

Very well put, and I'm surprised it took someone that long to finally put up a reply like that up there.

--Steve

[Steven Stahlberg]

Beauty is not in the eye of the beholder. It's a very objective and specific notion, very deeply ingrained in most humans.



None of these could be called plastic American ideals, and they're even quite different from each other. Yet you'll be lying if you said you found them ugly or even mediocre.
Yes they have some makeup applied, lighting is flattering etc. But no one I personally know could possibly look this good even with all that help - this is very rare.

They are from cultures totally different to ours, yet they are thought there to be among the most beautiful, and we agree. People all over the world would agree. And even if asian men think western women sometimes have features that are a bit craggy and exaggerated, they usually agree with us about which is beautiful and which is ugly. Infants have been tested with different faces, and they tend to look longer at the faces such as these, than others.

This has nothing to do with fascism or Hitler or eugenics or whatever. It does not mean these girls are better persons than any other girl, though unfortunately we subconsciously tend to treat them that way. And yes, it's true it's very possible to love someone who isn't extremely beautiful. Obviously we have to, since most people in the world are "fair-to-middling" in this regard. That doesn't mean the bias doesn't exist.

[Socar MYLES]

Jeeze! Who does all that to their hair? My idea of hair care at the moment is something like:

1. Wash. Use all-in-one shampoo/conditioner to avoid the bother of applying shampoo and conditioner separately.

2. Shake head around madly for 20 seconds or so.

3. Run fingers through hair in a vague approximation of brushing.

4. Allow to dry into a ridiculous spiky white-girl-fro looking thing.

When it was long, step 3 was substituted for actually brushing it, but....

No, I save time on my hair so I can spend my time using anti-wrinkle creams and moisturizers and all those silly things that are supposed to make one young and beautiful forever....

[InsaneSpaghetti]

It's true.
None of the girls I actually had a crush on (not a big number at all) were a classic boob-blonde or whatever thing.
It's the way they present themselves that matters. The slight movement of facial features, the undetectable umph. Look at Julia Roberts - she ain't no hottie theoretically, but she gosh darn is in life.
Therefore, there are really a lot of beautiful people in life, just not all are veratile enough to fit every person.
That's how, at least, I explain my appearance =).

And no, for all of you girls out there, boobs are not at all a factor for a real gentleman, so stop stuffing 'em with plastic.

[dr . bang]

btw here's something i notice:


Ideal man acccording to Asian women



Ideal man according to Western women (and some men..not me though i swear)



But this is just a big generalization, many ppl people prefer both.

[ July 27, 2001: Message edited by: dr . bang ]

[Socar MYLES]

Heh...It's not easy, being a plastic cheerleader type with no discernible personality. Why not?

1. My nine-inch-nails keep getting caught in my little fascist panties (see Tori Amos' 'Little Earthquakes' album for an explanation of that).

2. That wrinkle-nosed perplexed face that was so cute at fifteen has led to unbecoming wrinkles at twenty-five.

3. I have a $100/day hair care habit, and my nail budget could feed a small African nation for half a year.

4. On a related note, I've become addicted to hairspray fumes.

5. My eyebrows don't match my ponytail.

6. My carpets don't match my curtains.

7. Nobody ever, like, takes me SERIOUSLY!

8. I think the wind must have changed, 'cause I just can't...stop...smiling. Or giggling.

9. If I want to keep dating the guy with the sports car, I'm going to have to put out sooner or later.

10. Everyone's going to be doing coke at the party this weekend. It would be totally uncool not to participate. But, I don't know...the drinking wasn't so bad, apart from all the puking at the end of the night...but coke...isn't that hard drugs?

11. High school really was the best years of my life.

12. I can't remember #12.

[faustgfx]

yeah, asian men just don't have what it takes to please them ladies, hence why they need to resort to polygon built fictious characters.

[FatPenguin]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Steven Stahlberg:

They are from cultures totally different to ours, yet they are thought there to be among the most beautiful, and we agree. People all over the world would agree. And even if asian men think western women sometimes have features that are a bit craggy and exaggerated, they usually agree with us about which is beautiful and which is ugly. Infants have been tested with different faces, and they tend to look longer at the faces such as these, than others. exist.

---

I think you're wrong. There is a tribe in north Africa somewhere, where the beuty of a woman is directly proportional to the size of the clay disc they can insert into hole they cut out of their lower lip. In other cultures people of both sexes make use of metal rings in order to stretch their necks in order to attain the ideal body image.

There are certain generalizations you can make based on genetics. For example, we tend to prefer thin woman, as obesity suggests a greater chance of the woman dying and so on. But even that isn't universally true. North of the arctic circle a thin woman would be unlikely to survive a harsh winter, and so Inuit men tend to prefer their woman a little plump.

But the influence of fashion on our perception of beuty is certainly stronger than genetics. Back in the day in China the female half of the aristocrasy would cram their feet into tiny shoes, even though it meant they would be unable to walk by the time they were teenagers. There are plenty of renaissance paintings of Helen of Troy. She was supposed to be the most beutiful woman in the world, but few people viewing the paintings these days would agree. And hey, you don't have to go back that far, everyone in 80's was ugly!

[Lemur-X]

Actually, thin women being preferred is a *VERY* recent occurance.

Throughout history, desirable women have been plump.

Enough body fat to live off of in tough times, and with breasts that were somewhat saggy (a sign of previous mothering).

--Steve

[Socar MYLES]

Hey! I loved the eighties! I thought I looked great in my big blonde hair, my pink ostrich-feather coat, and my checkered hotpants! And I still miss my five-inch platform shoes, my leather jacket with 'RATS' written on the back in rhinestones, and the gold earrings that hung past my shoulders.

Man, I was a hot little twelve-year-old!

[Lemur-X]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Socar MYLES:
Hey! I loved the eighties! I thought I looked great in my big blonde hair, my pink ostrich-feather coat, and my checkered hotpants! And I still miss my five-inch platform shoes, my leather jacket with 'RATS' written on the back in rhinestones, and the gold earrings that hung past my shoulders.

Man, I was a hot little twelve-year-old!

---

It was all about the shredded jeans and my single white glove.

[Lunatique]

quote:

---

Originally posted by faustgfx:
yeah, asian men just don't have what it takes to please them ladies, hence why they need to resort to polygon built fictious characters.

---

Whoa. . .. Back off there, buddy. You are generalizing way too much there. I know lots of women that have a thing for asian guys.

[Bishop_Six]

Beth: wow, I'm glad I'm not a girl

Steven: that's a very good point.

[Superbug]

...polygons.....squall is made from polygons? What madness is this? I thought he was real all this time

[Steven Stahlberg]

quote:

---

I think you're wrong. There is a tribe in north Africa somewhere, where the beuty of a woman is directly proportional to the size of the clay disc they can insert into hole they cut out of their lower lip. In other cultures people of both sexes make use of metal rings in order to stretch their necks in order to attain the ideal body image.

---

Yes, I know, I've heard these arguments, they usually come up when beauty is discussed like this - about how Ruben's girls were so fat because they liked 'em that way back then, how some aztec or mayan indian tribe bound the forehads of their infants because they liked them to look like coneheads, about the chinese foot-binding, how some tribes practise ritual scarring... it goes on and on.

I think there are two levels at work in our brains with regards to this stuff. The limbic system or whatever it's called, the deeper parts of us that is irrevocably hard-wired and can only change over the course of millions of years, from evolutional pressure...

and then the cortex, or the higher functions, the part that thinks and figures things out for itself, which is great... except it's fickle and sometimes extremely stupid. It's the down-side of being so damn smart and creative and hyperactive, we can never leave things well enough alone. We always have to tinker with everything. Add on top of that - like wolves we are very social and hierarchical, and very eager to conform to the group.
Isolate a small sample of homo sapiens from the rest of us, and watch them over the centuries start adding more and more outlandish customs to their tradition... sometimes to the point where they erase themselves from the gene pool.

Customs and fashion can briefly and temporarily override some minor bits of the less defined parts of the limbic hard-wired set of rules.
Just like hypnosis can make us behave really strange for a while, but not change our basic nature, like make us hate someone we love.

About fat - the exact poundage doesn't seem to be encoded in us, but interestingly the ratio of hips to waist does seem to be. Only a very small percentage of the population (I think they call themselves 'fat-lovers'?) actually don't care if there's a waist there at all.

Yes it really annoys me how some americans can only go for one particular type of look, the blond cute bombshell look, nothing wrong with that except it gets real boring after a while. Julia Roberts was mentioned, she's a good example. I've always been partial to Cher myself...

[Jezebel]

Bishop: Ummm... that's not my hair routine. There's no way in hell I'd spend that much time on my hair. That's Romero's hair thing, hehe I got hair past my tail bone. I literally wash, brush and let it air dry.

[VengerZap]

There are tribes that consider natural deformaties as a sign of beauty. A man is more likely to be attracted to a woman that has club foot for example.

The idea of beauty changes so much. Look at the male sex symbols of the 60's, hairy chests, hairer mushtache.

In ancient Rome it was considered ugly to have a large penis!

[faustgfx]

lunatique: generalizing is good, individuals are so highly overrated it's not even funny.

[Ken McCracken]

Breasts are not considered erotic at all in the societies where the women don't cover them up.

[Enayla]

Actually...

Asian men can be very beautiful. Extremely beautiful. As far as features go, I do believe some of the most beautiful men I’ve ever seen are Asian.

As for ugly people - ugly men are the really buff guys that believe themselves to be SO hot. I walked into a gym, once, and had to leave lest I start laughing at the guys. Not my type at all. Type. I can’t speak for the rest of the world, but I like pretty boys - not handsome or muscular.

And when it comes to Tom Cruise... eck... eck, eck, eck. He’s SO not my type.

[Lunatique]

I never understood some of the very popular ideas of what's considered sexy in america. Take Pamela Anderson for example. I can't stand how she looks. She looks like a cheap whore, and america loves her! Have you seen pictures of her BEFORE she transformed into the hideous thing she is now? She actually used to be cute and natural. Don't get me started on those ugly implants. . .. Good thing she took them out.

Here are some trends I just don't get: 1)what's up with some women who paint lipstick OUTSIDE the shape of their lips? Do they think we can't tell that's not how their lips really look? It looks like clown makeup! 2)What about drawing heavy, dark outlines around the lips? What is THAT all about? 3)What is the obsesison with dark tans? Don't they know that by the time they turn 30, they'll look like dried up prunes?

*sigh* Thank God for natural women who don't feel the need to do any of that.

[Awetopsy]

hmm I edited my post in this thread because it made me sound like I was agreeing that there are ugly people..

I dont think anybody is ugly to everybody.

I will firmly hold to the idea that everybody is beautiful to somebody.. just not necessarily everybody...

for example look at Britney Spears, some guys think shes the hottest thing ever.. I myself and many others think she is not attractive at all, same with any beautiful woman or man.

personally I cant see what a woman would ever see in Tom Cruise I think his face is really akward.. If I were a girl (or a guy who liked guys) I wouldnt find Tom cruise attractive at all.

so really to say that anybody is Ugly really is a farce.

sorry if I offended anyone earlier.

[Gnome the Juggalo]

Hey fuck you people who only go for looks, the scrubs will win motherfuckers. Personality is the only thing in the world, fuck you all...

[balistic]

"Personality is the only thing in the world, fuck you all..."

Irony . . . painful . . . the goggles . . . they do nothing . . .