[nil900]

At first I want to apologize for posting this in the finished picture section without a finished pic. But it's important for this idea that there are many people taking part. There will be finished pics in here soon.

Some of you probably remember the idea of the sijun lessons I had before the forum closed.It's a very simple idea:
There is a given scene (given objects,lights and colours) which everybody tries to paint as good as possible (The pics can be rough but the light and colours should be as good as you can do). These pics will be posted to be compared with the images of the others. In a following discussion we will see what we did wrong. In the best case there would be a teacher who does his own painting to show how this scene would really look like. A TEACHER IS STILL MISSING!!
If this idea really works there could be a more complex scene afterwards.

For the first time I give you and me this very simple scene to paint - to learn something about light. Crits are welcome!

please use the colours in the left corner.
Brown for the ground, blue for the sky, orange for the cube and green for the cylinder. The objects should reflect the light a little (like some kind of metall- not chrome! just a little). I didn't think of textures for the first time cause it might be to complex for the first try.
The light source is a point light casting sharp shadows it's located behind the person watching the pic. The green line on the cylinder is the point directly hit by the light. Sorry I don't know how to explain that in English I hope you did understand what I'm thinking of. The light of the lightsource should be light yellow like sunlight.

The important question for me is:
how does the light of the sky and the ground influence the colours of the objects.

Now I'll try to paint this scene and post it in around two hours. PLEASE JOIN IN!

If I forgot something important to say about the scene please tell me. Please also tell me if you think that there are some mistakes in my thoughts. Crits are welcome too. And I would be very happy if there is someone who always wanted to be a teacher and shows us how this scene should look like (NO 3D renderings please!).

Sorry for my bad English.

Nils

[ October 06, 2001: Message edited by: nil900 ]

[Democritus]

hey nils

I really like that idea. I even started working on it and this is what it turned out to be. I think it is pretty good so far (never did an exercise similar to this one). It took me no as long as I had expected to. Maybe 10 to 15 minutes. I should start to measure the time stuff like that takes me.

Well whatever, the thing's uploaded and ready for inspection.



If anyone (that REALLY MEANS anyone) has got anything to say about it, go ahead.

EDIT: oops. totally forgot the sky in the picture X_X. Stupid me. Will change that right now.

[ October 06, 2001: Message edited by: Democritus ]

[nil900]

hi again.
Democritus thank you for joining. Looks like my explaination of my idea wasn't that bad. You did exactly what i was thinking of.

here is my first version:


These are the points I would like to discuss:

1: Does this side of the cube allso need some blue from the sky or just the yellow light from the light source?

2: does the ground reflect brown light on the cylinder, I think so but I don't know how the brown colour mixes with the light colour.

3:ups I forgot number three.

4:The backside of the cylinder is probably effected by the cubes colour but whats about the top of the cylinder (backside)? Does it look similar to my attempt?

5:Is there some brown from the ground in here?

I would also like to know what all of you think about the change in the saturation on the different sides of these objects.
I know zhat all these things depend on the material of the object but in my opinion all materials would behave at least a little the same.

[ October 06, 2001: Message edited by: nil900 ]

[Matt Elder]

Having never done had an 'art class' before I'm not sure whether it is a good thing or a bad thing that I've finally gone and worked on some simple shapes....hmmm... style is still a problem. nill900, how do you get that smooth looking green gradient down the side of the cyclinder?

[nil900]

hi Matt Elder, good to see another one joining in. Maybe we get what we wanted if there are one or two more people drawing this scene.
I got the gradient by painting the whole cylinder in that basic green. Then I painted the darkest and the lightest area with the normal photoshop brush (30-40% opacity). After that I painted the area between these two with the same colours but with less pressure (wacom pen of corse). If you do this over and over again and choose a new slightly different colour from the cylinder you get this effect.
Hope you understood what I mean because it's difficult for me to explain that in English if not tell me and I'll try again.

If there is somebody watching this who can tell us about the colour and light values in this scene please do so, thank you.

[EviLToYLeT]

Maybe this will help: http://www.anticz.com/drawing1.htm

[krAtul]

Here is mine, totally done with a mouse under Paint Shop Pro as I don't know Photoshop that much.



[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: krAtul ]

[Tillek]

Nice idea. I'm rather new to digital painting and all that, but here's my attempt. During compression it turned out a bit blury, or maybe I painted it that way...

[Matt Elder]

thanks for that nil900 and EviLToYLeT. I generally understand how it is done, just struggle to do it myself. I'll give it another try and see what I can come up with.

[Samson & Friends]

Here's my attempt, it was really helpful in understanding lighting a little more. I used the dodge and burn tool a little, is that bad? Thanks for posting a topic like this, it's great.


[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: Samson & Friends ]

[hovair]

Hi. I'm new to this board. I saw this post and I couldn't resist the urge to participate. It seems like a simple execize but it can get tricky with shadows, ambient lighting and reflective lighting. here's my attempt. pretty much the same as the most except i went a little lighter on the shadows.

[Tillek]

Awesome job hoviar, you nailed the shading right on. The only thing I noticed was that the shapes seemed to be slightly above the ground because of that dark shadow at their bases.

Very minor, and it's probably just me. Nice job.

[Dean Welsh]

meh. Why do I even try?

-dean

[spooge demon]

I will give crits if you want, I used to teach this kinda thing.

Two conditions, though. Make it B/w, and the objects finish is matte, or flat.

It is best to take this one step at a time and isolate each variable. Once you get a handle on one, you can add one more dimension at a time. These might be color, finish, complexity of form, details, etc. pretty soon you have a ford explorer at sunset in alaska. But for now, I like that everyone has the same drawing.

That line out there is not the horizon, maybe the edge of the table. It can be eliminated.

Once you get one lighting scheme understood, move the light around.

123 go!

[horstenpeter]

Here's my attempt. A bit rough, but I didn't spent too much time on cleaning it up. It was done in Open Canvas 1.1 which isn't really the program to use for clean images.
Tell me what you think. Was kind of a first timer for me, never spent any time rendering simple objects like this in color.

I'm with spooge on the lessons thing BTW, let's do this thing one by one. Would be better and we could still keep up the speed by decreasing the intervals between the exercises.

Another thing, maybe it's just me but is the perspective of the objects right ? If these things are a perfect cube and a perfect cylinder and the line is the horizon, shouldn't the top of the cylinder not be visible ? Except of course if the cylinder is tilted towards the viewer. But it doesn't appear to be. Also, the left side of the cube looks strange.....
Then again, maybe I'm wrong. I don't claim to have in-depth knowledge of perspective.

Anyways, great idea doing these exercises.

[edit]fixed the lightsource in the image[/edit]

[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: horstenpeter ]

[S4Sb]

I moved the horizon line to where I thought it was appropriate. And I have to admit that I haven't got a clue what I did right or wrong in this one.

[Eorand]

Ok here is my version... all comments accepted.

I used about on hour to compose this.

[gekitsu]

okay, my work:

i dunno what happened, but the shadows appeared darker in painter...

my main point where i struggled was the color of shadows.

[Juan-Philipo]

just nevermind this post...

[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: Juan-Philipo ]

[nil900]

Hi,
it's great that all of you take part. It's very interesting to see all these different paintings of the same pic. After looking at all these pics I spotted some mistakes in my picture (mine looks like the colours were washed out,...)But I still can't say which of these images are right or wrong because of that we are in need of a "theacher" I think.
Now we got the offer of spooge to help us out! Thank you for that spooge, I would be really happy if you would give us some advices. If I understood you right we should draw this scene in black and white and take the "sky" out. Am I right? Ok that's what I'll do next. Let's go for the ford explorer .

EviLToYLeT: That page doesn't show.

Dean Welsh: Your version looks good to me (a little more like shiny metall).

horstenpeter: You are probably right we should do this step by step. And it might be true that the perspective is wrong but i think that it doesn't really matter so I'll take that one.

S4Sb: that is my problem, too. I don'know what is right or wrong hope we will know it in the near future!

gekitsu: Interesting colours! I thought about the the cylinder shadow on the orange cube (what's the right english word for that orange thing?). You painted it a little green. Is that right what do all of you think?

Juan-Philipo:

Oh I just noticed that I can't post at freeservers anymore cause the login page can't be found. Does anyone know another
free server to post my pics?

[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: nil900 ]

[gekitsu]

i thought about making the shadows kinda complementary to the pseudo-cube's color. should have sticked out more blueish, you're right...
in fact, i mixed the shadows together of blues and greens (roughly complementary to the orange) and dark oranges and reds.

btw nil: geil, nochn deutscher zwar n fischkopp aber besser als keiner

[Dean Welsh]

here's my black and white matte one from a different light.

-Dean

[Freddio]

These are all awesome guys, this is very helpful indeed..

I spent far too much time on this hrmm..

[horstenpeter]

Here we go in B/w. Redid the whole thing and corrected some things I didn't like about my first one.

Freddio, yours just looks awesome ! Incredibly clean, and the reflection on the floor...... 8)

[morphgfx]

@nil900: cool topic!

@spooge: crits would be very, very much appreciated!

anything from anybody about color charts, complimentary colors, warms and cools, whatever about color would be very useful.

oh, and this my attempt...
i think i paid to less (no?) attention to the main question, how ground and sky influences the color of the objects... just noticed while reading the thread again...

[silber]

quote:''Make it B/w, and the objects finish is matte, or flat.''
-hope I got you right.
(may the pic be rough? or should it already be rendered more carefully?)

selfcriticism:
the shadow on the cuboid
is too dark. the shadow the cuboid
casts is to edgy--->random light would soften it up.



[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: silber ]

[phob]

hi
i'm not used to paint things and this is one of my first attempts... as i'm new to it, this thread really helped me to figure out a lot of things



[ October 07, 2001: Message edited by: phob ]

[nil900]

My host side is running again. Here is my first b&w try.

[Termite]

Here's my attempt...

[-Tepox-]

more serious attempt.

[ October 08, 2001: Message edited by: -Tepox- ]