[Ian Jones]

Content is King... pretty much says it all.

I'm making myself a personal website, and I will include tutorials and resources that I can offer. I don't want to produce any same old, same old... tutorials. I was wondering if you could tell me what you think is lacking in the online art community. What sort of tutorials would you like to see?

I'm mainly a graphic designer, so I won't be offering any 'how to paint' type tuts, and I also don't want to make any 'how to make aqua buttons' photoshop tuts.

I do however want to do something original, something inspiring. Has anyone had any idea's they have always wanted to do, yet never been able to? I really want to make my site an exciting and inspiring place to be.

[FSME]

How about something on proper color usage? Not as in "Don't use red and pink together" but more the general type.
I know, in art there are no right or wrong colors, but in "general audiences" (i.e. the ignorant rest of the world ) there is.

[Ian Jones]

There are plenty of websites with colour theory already... I'm looking for something original. I want to steer clear of "do this, then this, and you'll have this..."

[[666]Flat]

Tentacle rape mangas always do the trick.

At least for me.

[FSME]

Do you want to cover a broad spectrum of general topics (i.e. "How to properly use the Magic Wand tool" etc.) or do you want to go into details for sample pics (i.e. "this is how you do a sleeping dragonfly in the rain" etc.)?

[ June 26, 2002: Message edited by: FSME ]

[Gort]

From a graphic designers traditional standpoint:

Showcase designers from the past to the present; present their strengths and principles.

Showcase historical references in design and how its effected the present day (Constructivism, de Stijl, Malevich, Kandinsky, etc)

From a tutorial standpoint, illustrate current principles for good design - show good examples and bad example; describe why they work or don't work. Illustrate techniques for design (color balancing, grid layout). Illustrate the differences and conventions between your basic columnated editorial publication and non-so-convential publication (Raygun, Wired, etc)

From a Web Base Standpoint:

All of the above, but place a strong warranted emphasis on the user experience and the ramifications of good usability.

Damn...my coffee's cold.

[Torstein Nordstrand]

I'd like to see that "Good picture vs. Bad picture" section that Tom is proposing - I want to learn how to spot quality, and how to improve through knowing what makes a picture seem/feel right. I neither want nor need a tutorial simply showing me how somebody did something - I want to know why the particular choices were made. A real explanation, not just a before and after forum overpaint.

I get some of that in this here forum, so thanks to you all. Ian, simply put up some pages were you critique the way you do here - I always enjoy reading your interpretations!

[Ian Jones]

Thx guys. I got a few ideas now. I too am also interested in analysing works, as a designer I am constantly in search of that 'undefinable ultimate aesthetic'. Based on my experiences, and opinions I search the net and when I find something that I really like, and find visually stimulating I love to sit there and stare at it trying to unlock its 'secrets'. Trying to analyse just why it looks good. Is that the sort of thing you think is missing? something more along those lines? Of course something like that would be very strongly baed on my opinions and design philosophies... yet I am always interested in getting insight into other ppls process, and philosphies. Do you guys want stuff like that?

I'm just trying to get a bit of discussion going, so feel free to throw some more ideas around.

[666]Flat: I wouldn't dare imagine intruding on your type of content 'market'.

FSME: Broader things, not neccesarily 'how to use the magic wand tool' but instead 'things you could do, the possibilities of the magic wand tool'... that sort of stuff.

Tom Carter: K, cool I hadn't initially thought of that, so thx for the ideas. I don't submit to the principles of 'that is good design' becuase I feel it is so undefineable and open to interpretation that I could only offer my personal perspectives on such subject matter, neatly trimmed to what I think is 'broadly accepted' of course. So in a way I do follow the principles but also am wary of their restrictions. Do you think that you would still find these sort of tuts/discussions of interests/inspiration? I kind of like the idea.

Torstein Nordstrand: Thx for your reply, you definetely refined some of those ideas Tom Carter, brought up... interesting. I too agree that seeing a paintover without some analysis/discussion is not as useful as it could be. I'm glad you enjoy my interpretations..

Thx guys, thats refined a few ideas for me. I geuss primarily I'm interested in the very idea of making such resources/tuts available as a help to others, but also as a point of exploration and knowledge base for myself. I'm sure some of you have experienced this by helping others here at the forums, you work things out for yourself and learn in the process.

Enough of my blabber keep it coming!

[hans_e]

hey!

awesome idea, man. The site will definitely be added to my fav folder. Keep us all posted and whatnot. *rubs hands together with anticipation*

[Ian Jones]

np, I certainly will let you know when I get it up and running. I'm just using this thread to gain some ideas from ppl. So feel free to make any suggestions.

[Gort]

quote

Quote:

I do follow the principles but also am wary of their restrictions. Do you think that you would still find these sort of tuts/discussions of interests/inspiration?

Yeah - I do. I would take a "laddered" approached with the base showing the conventional approaches as defined by fundementals; this would be an excellent resource for beginners / students. You could then perhaps go up another level; how did it come to be? What is consistent and reflective of this level to the level before? Were any rules broken? And so on...

If you don't want to reflect history and the norm, use your own work to illustrate the point.

Now that's just an idea...

[egerie]

sounds really promising everyone is having great ideas. I'm looking forward to this website !

[Ian Jones]

heh... I don't want to drum it up too much. Plz don't expect any miracles. I'll show my work, mainly graphic design stuff...

What I envisage is a personal website that, as well as having visual displays of my work, also has written explanations of my design theory. They way I work, and why I do stuff like it is. I geuss I just want to try and write it down for myself as reference and to explore the ideas more completely. As a benefit to other ppl though I will write it in a tutorial / rant sort of style that should hopefully be interesting and a reflection of what my idea of 'design' is. It just something I feel like I want to try and do. I would like to communicate a much friendlier, less 'sterile' view of what 'design' is.

Sounds kind of silly... but hey, if you don't like it. tuff shit.

I want to make a site that I would really like to visit myself.

[Little Beefucker]

I tell you what I love, is when I go to an artist's site and he guts himself, showing all the steps of his work. It's a very compelling thing.

What you get then is your art, in several stages, exposed and bruised with every fault, and that's rewarding to viewers who love the art but are too intimidated by the final product to ever attempt something like it. Not that I'd recommend showing crappy work for the sake of making artists feel good about themselves, but there's a very intimate something to it. Very brave.

When I see stuff like that, I remember it. It shows more of the artist than the art alone, and since that's what art is about (ideally), it becomes much more than a tutorial.

*Clunking ideas in head* Nobody wants to give away personal secrets, of course. But check out Ashley Wood's setup. He uses screen caps of half-finished work to populate his site, almost like a tutorial. It's new and inspiring and witty, and it teaches you something new about him and about how to draw like him -- without ripping him off, even!

That's what I love. Heh heh!

[ July 11, 2002: Message edited by: Little Bee ]

[Ian Jones]

Here's a sample idea I just typed up. It is a sort of rant / philosophy I geuss... check it out and let me know what you think.

--start--

Designers conscience: Pleasing the masses with ‘average taste’

Personally, while I’m working on a design I seem to seek some sort of direction not only from the usual sources (like the design brief), but from what I envisage a reaction to my design will be. Keeping the end audience in mind is important to me. Call it self-aware but I feel that by showing my work it becomes a reflection of me in some way.

So while I’m brainstorming an idea or working out a concept I like to play out in my mind situations like “How would ---insert name here--- like this? What would they say about it?”. Often on a personal level I use good friends in this situation, because I know them and know how I think they would most likely react. In simple terms, I value their opinions. This helps me to kind of regulate the content of my designs and in effect it does alter some of the decisions I make during the design process. I also think about “What would the average Joe Bloggs say about it?” and “I wonder what other designers would think?”.

Maybe that’s a bad thing. It could take over. It could make me a slave to society’s accepted tastes. It could mean that I will design boring ‘copycat’ artwork. However, I am aware of this. I think it is important to be aware of this sort of ‘Designers Conscience’. Who says it is wrong to be a ‘Trend-whore’? Maybe if you think a little more carefully about it then you can realise that it isn’t necessarily just simple copying. It does require thought and careful study to recognise trends and figure out how to get inside that skin to produce an artwork. The difference as I see it is in recognising when you are being controlled by this conscience and utilising it to your benefit.

Getting a little more practical now… So how does this affect the way I design?

Well now that I know that I do this, I use that conscience and my perception of the ‘average taste’ of most people to help me either produce an artwork that sits so comfortably with as many people as I can get it to… or … I use it to help me push the limits of ‘average taste’ (subtly of course, none of this ‘piss on a painting’ kind of stuff!) to hopefully spark interest and maybe expand the horizons of the ‘average taste’. I love seeing new things, so I also love enrichment by variety. Maybe by recognising the ‘average taste’ I will know where to push and mold it in order to expand and enrich design.

A quick example would be to look at the whole ‘girls like pink, boys like blue’ clich�. I’m not saying that I personally like pink! (I’m still a slave to society ) but I’m saying that it would be interesting to push the limits of it and maybe introduce some slightly purple blues into that baby boy outfit or perhaps some slightly more magenta type reds? These two colours may just encroach upon pink, with just enough acceptability to seem ‘normal’ and in good ‘average taste’. It’s something to think about anyway…

As another example I’ll use this image I made for fun in about January ’02.

I did it for fun. I did it for experimentation. I wanted to try out the colour palette and I had also read something about designing to music for inspiration. So I had a go at it.



I’m going to try and read your thoughts a bit here. I’m geussing that you’re probably thinking:

1. It’s sort of weird. I don’t really get what its about.

2. It has some nice stuff though. The colours are interesting and the texture too.

3. Looks kinda cool, I *like it.

*Hopefully!

Well that’s what I’m geussing, based on my perception of ‘average taste’ and the way I think a variety of people would react to it. As I remember, I had these same thoughts as I designed it and when I stopped to look at it when finished. That was my ‘Designers conscience’. I was experimenting with this picture, and although that’s not a reason for making weird pictures, I also wanted to make sure I made something other people could also enjoy. That meant I threw in some ‘weirdness’ with the blocky shapes, seemingly useless typography and general lack of any message but hopefully I managed to balance this with the interesting colours and textures.

Well that’s enough of my ranting for now… Hopefully that was of interest to you and the way you may design in the future. I have clarified a few things in my mind by writing this. It has helped me think through one of the many aspects that affect the way I design.

--end--

Little Bee: Thanks for the link. Interesting Idea. Not knowing how things are done is definetely intimidating. I am a little bit wary of giving away my 'secrets', but then I wouldnt know them if someone else hadn't revealed them to me. I don't mind if ppl can copy my techniques by just doing a tutorial, becuase I know the one thing that I will always have that unique to me is the next idea that hasn't come to fruiton yet.

[ July 11, 2002: Message edited by: Ian Jones ]

[ July 11, 2002: Message edited by: Ian Jones ]

[Gort]

quote

Quote:

A quick example would be to look at the whole �girls like pink, boys like blue� clich�. I�m not saying that I personally like pink! (I�m still a slave to society)

Ah...but most designers to some extent are slaves to society. If you follow the fundementals of collective contructivism, then design is intended for the masses and should effectively communicate a message. You should therefore consider who you're designing for. If you're selling books or electronics, then you have to account for the lowest common denominator, but if you want to share your expressive and creative nature with others, then run with it; however, when dealing with web design don't forget good usability; make it simple but engaging (a challenge in itself).

quote:

---

�What would the average Joe Bloggs say about it?� and �I wonder what other designers would think?�.

Maybe that�s a bad thing. It could take over.

---

A blessing and curse - if ask me. Sometimes your peers can be constructive but without any tact. If you start designing for other designers, you might find yourself digressing from where you really wanted to go (the Curse). If it feels good to you, then do it, but looking at it too long might deter you from seeing any istakes - that's where a peer review might help...maybe (the Blessing).

As for you posted piece, I love it. It makes me feel good. I can't explain it, but it's warm and approachable, and the texture just feels good to me.

shazah - moving right along...

[Ian Jones]

Tom Carter: Yes, your thoughts there are exactly the kind of thing I wanted to highlight. Do I maybe need to do a conclusion? Also any suggestions on grammar, anything at all would be much appreciated.

Glad you also like the pic. Thx.

[ July 11, 2002: Message edited by: Ian Jones ]

[egerie]

Ian Jones : I agree 100% with little bee. I love to see how a person works but more so how the person THINKS when working.
Yes it takes time to analyse everything you do since most of it is done unconsciously but it can profit, enlighten (and perhaps suprise) someone to the point where they grow. I love teaching. I love seeing people understand what I had to learn the hard way. I love to learn too. That's why I was sounding so enthusiastic.
Don't worry I'm not expecting a full course or anything but this kind of err.. 'marksmanship' seems to be scarce.

anyway.. cheers!

[Gort]

Ian - sorry for the late reply.

A conclusion is typically brought about by a comparitive anylasis, so if you do a comparitive anylasis of design, then yes - a conclusion would be appropriate.

As for grammer, I am not sure I follow you entirely; do you mean the proper use of basic grammer (which I guess you do), or do you mean the design of grammer through simplified constructs through syntax (lots of writings on this but I am having difficulty finding the resources)? Either way, the grammer is important - epsecially if someone were to actually reference your site in scholarly work (which could occur). Consider that any comparitive anylasis should be treated with proper grammatics.

[Ian Jones]

I just suck at grammar and punctuation so if you notice mistakes just give me a yell.

[Pixel Soldier]

mold = mould

[Ian Jones]

Thx Pixel Soldier, your name will go down in constructive comment history! For the huge contribution you have made.

[Gort]

Hey - my grammar sucks too from time to time, and I often mispell stuff - especially here (I am usually at work when posting and don't have a whole lot of time to proof). Just remember that when your presenting an idea or point of view, take the time to go over it; make sure it's polished. I know it's somewhat of a hassle, but a well presented argument could be deflated by mispelled words and the like. Get someone else to proof your stuff - even if it's your mom, dad, friend, etc.

You relaize our expectations for your content are now in the stratosphere...


btw...that edit notice means I mispelled some stuff in haste - again.

[ July 13, 2002: Message edited by: Tom Carter ]

[Asurfael]

geussing = guessing. You've done that once in the tutorial, and once before in your posts... Well now that that is out of the way, that'd make a great intro for more detailed descriptions on how the stuff is actually done. Maybe I am a bit stuck with these "do this and do that"-tutorials in my thinking, but...

Well, a good start, I can't wait to see more!

[Ian Jones]

hehe... Yeah couldn't agree more Asurfael. I took a look at it again and I can see what you mean. Nice diplomatic style you got there. lol

[AndyT]

I enjoyed reading your sample idea a lot! It's quite easy to follow your thoughts
(which are good thoughts to have IMHO)
You must be typing real fast! Maybe you should consider visiting this site

I too can't wait to see more!

[Catfish]

A tutorial on composition would be nice...
Lots of people suggest dividing the canvas into thirds and / or using golden ratios. Some actual examples would be good to see.